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Forum Index : Other Stuff : Battery Rescue?
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isaiah Guru  Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
HI Go back a few pages in this post and there is info posted on desulphaters. I only know of one or two manufactures the make a combined unit and are quit pricey. we run the desulphater on our battery bank all the time and the unit sold for around 35.00 u.s. and sometime they would make a package deal where you get a price break on 3 units. http://www.infinitumstore.com/12v-infinitum-desulfator URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
I could be wrong, but I think that if you want charger/desulfator you should be looking for something like this one: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/12V-Battery-Desulfator-Charger-Le ad-Acid-GEL-AGM-Calcium-Deep-Cycle-/370813890285?pt=AU_Elect ronics_Batteries_Chargers&hash=item56563aeeed#ht_873wt_719 
George |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
Bit small picture, try again just the unit itself 
George |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
no body having battery questions? Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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JA Robby Newbie  Joined: 20/07/2010 Location: JamaicaPosts: 13 |
Hi Isaiah, I have two trojan 105 6 volts 225 amps batteries and i notice that they have swellings around the positive terminal and the side,Can these batteries be restored? ja robby No man is an island. |
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mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Swelling of the top and or side indicates to battery is stuffed...most likely not restoreable. Read the entire topic from the start, it prety much covers all the different situations, but no two batteries are the same, if you have the time maybe you will have some luck with them, might be worth a try. Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
http://www.howtodothings.com/how-to-refurbish-car-batteries http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Can_epsom_salt_regenerate_12v_car_ battery I bumped several times into “Epsom Salts” half remedy for tired 12V lead acid batteries. What doesn’t agree with my logic are 2 things: Some sites advocate draining all liquid from battery, replace it with Epsom Salts solution then normally charge the battery. (Does it mean that Epsom Salts magically change to acid that battery needs?) Another method mentioned is to add several tea spoons of distilled water solution of Epsom salts and leaving it there. (Doesn’t it produce some kind of residue that will settle at the bottom and short each of the cells?) Hope this post fits into this thread. George |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
The epsom salts attack. I have never seen a Epsom Salts treatment fix a battery, although many have tried various applications, from a small dose to revitalize cells to a full flush on industrial batteries, this will Clean the battery out? but most of the battery active plate material is lost and the battery is only a small shadow of its former self, I know people that swear a battery can be rejuvenated by an Aspro or two in each cell and while it gives a short term boost to the voltage in a non shorted cell it also is not a long term fix. The only worthwhile results I have had is with a desulphator, the cells that started this discussion nearly three years ago are still doing useful work (running my pressure pump on the house system, They would not be good enough to run a heavy duty load such as starting a diesel engine, but are useful in their role as a light and sound system supply for the house. My car battery died 3 years ago and on fitting a desulphator it is still struggling along, not to full capacity but it runs the car, was it worth it not really as a $200 new battery would have been better but it's better than nothing. I think that the only way to go for a reliable nearly destruction proof battery is a set of nife cells, yes expensive, but a life of 30 plus years and nearly fool proof has a lot going for it, that is if we can live long enough to see them out??? All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
Bob, Thank you for post. May I ask where would you buy NiFe batteries in Australia? George |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
HI Bob, Good to see you posting again. We have been busy here also. The big tractor battery I posted about here some time back is going strong, I had gotten two but one didn't come back and I think we had a hi decibel event with it. One thing we learned is that some of the cell connectors and post to cell connectors are just a press fit and not soliderd! We think this is where a lot of the problems are in these modern day car battery's. Bub and i restored a old Hayer battery charger and this one charges with out putting much heat in the battery. It helps to keep the battery you are working on out of the sun. We have been working on one of AGM battery and we have it setting in a dish pan with water in it to keep the temp down. TAKE CARE ALL Isaiah. URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
http://www.ironcorebatteries.com.au/page5.php Foolin Around |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
Thank you VK4AYQ From their Webpage this bit looks scary: "Prices do not include GST, shipping, bank charges (including exchange rate fees), customs & import duty fees or local transport costs." It can add up to few thousand in case of 10 pieces of 500 or 800 Ah George |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi George I agree they are expensive but when worked out over a long term they do become more attractive in a KW per day situation compared to a dollar per year for the term of 30 + years. I believe they could be produced as a backup load system that is the illusive problem with all solar, and if mass produced the price would fall in line with demand as we have seen across the electronic parts industry. In the future cost of electricity will at best 3% per annum inflation to around 7% we have experienced in the last few years, that makes the long term variability more attractive. Would be a good infrastructure project for government instead of wasting money on underwater macrami type projects that are so popular with politicians. The energy is there for the using but with present mind set of use all we can and then winge at the bill, cost will modify usage patterns and to some extent appliances to cut usage and to modify minds by means of pain in the wallet. Remember off peak electricity is cheaper to buy because it costs dollars to keep plant running at wasteful levels overnight, so to me the so called base load is another furfey used to justify a commercial action to make huge profit for at least three levels of corporation including the government. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
So true. NiFe batteries are considered low 'everything' What should household look at, if average (annual) usage is between 3600kWh to 3900kWh? Should it be system of 10 units 1000Ah, 20 units 1000Ah or rather 30 to be 100% sure that system will cover more than 90% of annual demand? George |
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Tinker Guru Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904 |
Just out of curiosity I googled NiFe batteries to find out the cell voltage (1.2V - one needs 3 times the cells than LiPo technology. however, apparently NiFe cells can be home made, some interesting info can be found here Klaus |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Tinker Very interesting reading, it will take me a few days to digest it. I think there could be a good opportunity for a battery cottage industry as commercial look at ongoing resale of product they wouldn't be much interested in these. Bob Foolin Around |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi George I am saving for a 24 volt 1000AH set for my setup here, it will eventually replace my 24 volt 2000 AH SLA set that is getting a bit tired. The SLA set or wet cells Lead acid die quickly if you discharge much below 50% whereas the Nife cells will go 80% or more without damage. The charging losses foe NIFE cells is higher at around 15% and self discharge is higher but that's not an issue on a daily cycling setup such as solar. I note you are using around 10KW per day so it would be wise to schedule high usage times to when there is good sunlight or wind if you have a mill, a little bit of self examination and use modification should bring your off solar cycle to around 4 KW. Mine is 4 KW running a fridge and freezer computer, lights and TV or stero, the toaster and electric kettle.the water pump is run of a separate 12 volt 120 Watt panel set that is around thirty years old and retired from active service it has enough extra capacity to run the lights if necessary and float the 3 cars and tractor battery, normally fully charged by lunch time. I try to use power when the sun is working and that charges the main battery and provides some grid fees around 1000 KW over 12 months. I have an extra 15 / 250 watt panels to put up but health issues is holding that up. the panels working at the moment is 1.5 KWH It is cheaper to buy several extra panels than provide huge battery reserve, as even on full overcast days the panels are still working a bit 150 to 200 watts so all is not lost. It is good fun to play with and had paid for itself over four years and the savings on the electricity bill are growing all the time. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| Georgen Guru Joined: 13/09/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 462 |
Pity they are 1.2V, as it would it be much easier for me to get 100Ah or even 200Ah at a time of 12V ones, especially that NiFe batteries are so long living. (If I could pick them up from Battery Shop I could buy one at a time too I suppose) So making my own Ni-Fe batteries would be fantastic, as I can make them one at a time. They can wait dry until there are at least 2 or 3 to gradually start to use them with the help of DC/DC converter to bring voltage to at least 5V for USB devices. George |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
Hi all Dose any one have any experience or input on using Alum rather than the battery acid? I see they are some that put alum in instead of the acid sent with the battery and some are replacing the acid with Alum. My question is will the battery still have the same amp hr and voltage of use? '  '
How long will a battery last using Alum? Dose anyone have a good source to buy alum in the U.S.? We traded our junk battery's and got 6 new golf cart battery's and had to give some boot money also. '  '
Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
Firstly i thought Alum was a dumb idea to use for a battery, but after a little looking around i actually think it might have some merit, should you care to rebuild a set of dead Pb batteries from taking them apart and starting again. If you have the dead batteries and the time is free to rebuild them with Alum, then it may be well worth the effort. I doubt Alum is that costly, but i dont know what element form of Alum is used, the most common is Potassium alum, then there is .... soda alum, ferric alum,ammonium alum. Potassium alum is as common as the deodorant crystal you buy as the supermarket (because it is a Potassium alum crystal use in deodorant) As for cost and power output i donk know except it looks promising, if you consider a dead throwaway battery revived to a somewhat working level than that has to be an advantage for a little work and low chemical costs. Pete. Sometimes it just works |
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