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larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 02:47am 07 Mar 2012
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I have attached a photo of one of rhe Float Switches I bought from JayCar.
But it only has about 15 mm of Hystersis.
This means that when the water level falls to the point where the contacts close (and starts the pump running) the water level only has to rise about 15 mm before the contacts open & the pump stops.
So if you have a narrow tank (eg. a length of downpipe) then the pump will be starting/stopping frequently.
If you want it to run for a longer time & therefore start/stop less often, then you will need either a second Float Switch (one to start the pump & the other to stop it) or a simple timing circuit to keep the pump running for a longer time each time it starts.
Len
Edited by larny 2012-03-08
Tinker Guru Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904
Posted: 02:19pm 07 Mar 2012
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Len, looking at that float switch it appears easily modified for a greater hysteresis.
All you need to do is find a PVC or poly tube to fit over the barrel like float very well. Fit a cork to the end of that and your new water level range is set by the additional tube length.
The switch is shown upside down BTW, the moving part has to hang down and float up - when it lines up the switch operates.
Klaus
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 12:44am 08 Mar 2012
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Klaus,
That's a good idea.
But the length of tube will depend upon how wide the tank is.
It may even be useful to attach a weight at the end of the tube to make it less bouyant.
I did not think about which way to orient the FS before I took the photo.
However, I think the orientation in the picture is correct as you want the contacts to close when the water level drops & to open when it rises.
Len
Tinker Guru Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904
Posted: 02:01pm 08 Mar 2012
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You may be right there Len , but as it very much looks like a switch for a bilge pump and I'm a sailor I'd want it to close when the bilge water gets too high Klaus
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 09:35am 11 Mar 2012
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I already thought of that fellaz.... overflow outlet above the max fill line for the float switch. Should return back to pond in case of malfunction. Bit like some old sinks in old houses with the overflow port that falls down the back of the sink. Easy...
It's got me thinking width ways rather than depth of reservoir/header.Edited by Lapsy 2012-03-12This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 10:14am 11 Mar 2012
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Please excuse the electrical wiring for the battery it just gets in the way a bit.
Gotta love Microsoft Paint! I can sell you a full colour print of this for $24.99! Haha
Hope you like the idea anyways! I think its decent. Please pick out any areas that may cause issues and comment/trouble shoot anything that comes to mind. Pretty sure this is what you lot are basically getting at. Forgot to mention I am adding a pump into the header tank as its cheaper than a valve. Float kicks it off. If it doesn't the header fills up into the overflow returning back to pond as a precaution.
Edited by Lapsy 2012-03-12This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 09:27pm 11 Mar 2012
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I don't fully understand the diagram.
How is the Timer & Pump wired?
Why is the Float Switch connected to the Solar Regulator?
Note that you don't want the Float Switch to switch high currents.
It should control a relay so the relay contacts switch the high currents.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 04:54am 12 Mar 2012
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Thought the regulator handled any outgoing electricity used while the panel is still charging the battery. Correct me if I am wrong. I'm just looking at regulators on ebay and that's how this particular one is wired up by the looks of it.
Also...How come I cannot edit my posts any longer? I want to re post my picture. I can only edit the last one posted now?
Anyway I will add this to my diagrams. The 2 pools of water are like this and imagine this it happening via a solar pump on its own circuit just turning the water up and over or filtering for the fish or whatever...
You fill your header tank somehow from the higher smaller pool. I recon tap into it from underneath with slim 6mm line or something for a slow fill over a few hours to reach the dropping point for the float. Header would sit somewhere at mid height between the 2 pools. Run it off and back into the lower pond.Edited by Lapsy 2012-03-13This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 05:43am 12 Mar 2012
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yes, I found I could not edit my posts after another one has been posted.
The regulator will control the battery charging, but I doubt if it would have an input for the Float Switch.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 08:09pm 20 Mar 2012
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Ok Larny,
Run me through the forward current measuring, obtained a 12v pump. Lets see what the deal is with it and go from there.
Still interested in the timer idea as well as the float so, prepared to have a go at both and there will probably be a use for them at some stage.This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 10:03pm 20 Mar 2012
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I explained how to measure the motor resistance in an earlier post, so I won't repeat it here.
You can measure the current when it is running by connecting your Ammeter in series.
I need to know both.
I have attached a modified Timer circuit that shows you how to modify the PCB to make allowance for the Float Switch.
There appears to be plenty of vacant space on the PCB so you can drill a few 1 mm holes for the Diode, Resistor & connector.
Interconnect them with hook up wire of some kind.
The second attachment shows the type of connector that you could mount on the PCB for the FS cable.
They are easy to extract from old appliance such as Bed Lamps, Fans, etc.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 03:38am 21 Mar 2012
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"measure the current when it is running by connecting your Ammeter in series"
No worries, I will have a go tonight & see what it boots out.
Will be running it off 10 X AA just for the moment for power.
This thing looks alright, it shot a 2 foot fountain up in the sink when I tested it, so pressure from it is way better than expected for the size (bit bigger than a matchbox - small but cheap to experiment with) so see how I go from here.
Cheers for the diagrams, will study them more soon. Suddenly busier these days compared to when I started this thread! Not to worry I will get there eventually...This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 02:18pm 31 Mar 2012
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Quick update....
Not tested anything yet! Haha
Back later.... This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 09:02pm 31 Mar 2012
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Glad to see you're still in the land of the living.
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 06:24am 03 Apr 2012
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Yes! I have not had the pleasure of electricution yet.
Playing around with some other side projects that have been distracting.
float valve arrived working. looks same as yours except black & got no lug nut to thread on. Thats the only catch for the price. Briefly tested and switch works. Still trying to work out best way to use that.
Think I get what you are saying about the 15mm play on the switch. Would be good it that switch activated a relay or something to keep it passing current for about 30 seconds before switching off. Instead of completely relying on the actual switch as the volume of water would have to be quite a wider area than expected to run off the float switch alone.
Anyways I will go off & play again, and come up with another idea soon. Catchup again on here in a little while....
P.S Also... for the record.... the AA in the timer is still going strong after a few weeks. Not recharged it whatsoever and its holding up great. Definate improvement stamina wise...This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 09:11am 03 Apr 2012
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I will design a simple 30 sec timer for you that will hold the relay in your Arlec Timer operated for an extra 30 seconds as requested.
What I believe you want is as follows:-
1. The Arlec Timer will operate the relay to start the pump.
2. When the water rises to the point where the float switch goes open, the 30 Sec timer will start.
3. The 30 sec timer will hold the relay operated for 30 seconds. Then the relay releases & the pump stops.
4. When the water level falls to the point where the float switch contacts close, the relay will re-operate and the pump will start again.
5. When the water level rises and the float switch opens again, go to step 3.
Is this what you want?
Len
Edited by larny 2012-04-04
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 01:32pm 04 Apr 2012
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That sounds good.
Once again I could regulate flow after the circuit does its thing by using 25mm hose or 13mm or even something like 6mm if I wanted to slow it down or increase. Could also set the Arlec for a second fill 2 minutes later or whatever.
Have a go if you like for sure. List your prices of components and I will shop around.
Cheers! This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 10:25pm 05 Apr 2012
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I'll concentrate on the electronics & leave the plumbing to you.
I have attached a timing diagram of a possible senario.
I buy my parts from Semtronics as they are cheaper than the others & are located only about 2 km from where I live.
I'll send them an email & ask for the prices of the parts.
Len
larny Guru Joined: 31/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 346
Posted: 02:00am 09 Apr 2012
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Please measure the voltage as shown in the attachment.
I need you to measure it when the relay is operated by the Arlec Timer.
I don't need to know what the voltage is when the relay is released as it will be 0.
Len
Lapsy Senior Member Joined: 28/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 103
Posted: 03:55am 09 Apr 2012
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What is the above diagram a picture of? Is that the silicon chip mod or just part of the timer in general? Just curious as the internals are quite different to what's shown here. Have a look again at the pictures posted of mine, if it makes sense just circle where to drop the multimeter onto if possible. Failing that I guess I am suppossed to have already built the silicon chip mod? This is my signature ---> Scribble, scrawl, a bit of light pencil shading, some indelable ink and a bit of caligraphy.
Notice. New forum software under development. It's going to miss a few functions and look a bit ugly for a while, but I'm working on it full time now as the old forum was too unstable. Couple days, all good. If you notice any issues, please contact me.
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, but as it very much looks like a switch for a bilge pump and I'm a sailor I'd want it to close when the bilge water gets too high 
