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Forum Index : Solar : Deciding if I should build this solar heater
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Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 01:33am 18 Aug 2021
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Is very sunny here today but still quite cool. I only put the Diesel heater on low last night and it wasn't enough. Temps inside fell to 16 last night.
Certainly a perfect day for a solar setup though. Very clear and the tubes would be getting loads of warmth. I think this is the time Rogers setup will really shine, pun intended. For us peasants with the poorly insulated houses, even though it's warm enough and sunny outside, still too cool inside. It's rather frustrating actually.
I don't like putting heaters on through the day, especially when it's sunny but it's uncomfortable without them ATM. Something passive and looks after itself would make a great difference in these sorts of Conditions.
I was out in the sun and warmth earlier and now I have come back in the temp difference feels huge and like I walked into an ice box.
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 01:33pm 18 Aug 2021
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I have no clue, I've never really thought about it. I kinda thought it was too late to do anything anyway ... but I guess there may be some options.
Certainly for the inside walls you could drill little holes and poke a nozzle through ... then patch them up afterwards.
But like you say ... I hate to think of the expense.
We bought this place direct too. I actually came to an auction here years ago where it was passed in. A couple years later a friend told us it was still for sale ... so we negotiated with the owner ... went to a solicitors together and drew up a contract ... then bought it.
I think we are both very happy to have this place and have no ambitions to go anywhere. Although thinking about the distant future, I can see we could perhaps subdivide the paddock eventually and build a smaller retirement place there and sell this one.
Haha ... I'll say! Same goes for Adelaide and that's one tenth the size.
We're only an hour from the city centre ... but for us means there's still plenty of empty space between here and there. I only go there a few times a year and each time reminds me of why we live out here.
I think it's the waste of time sitting in traffic that kills it for me ... and that's just one day. Multiply it by 365 and I'd go crazy.
Wow, what a problem to have. Half his luck. Would have to be a very nice feeling knowing you have that sort of asset behind you, with all the choices that brings.
Blimey, looks like a cross between a hotel, a convention centre and a restaurant. Very nice all the same, but a bit out of my league.
Haha ... you don't really know what we're like ... there'd probably be a petition started to keep us ferals out.
Looking at the map I see it's right next door to Narellan ... I do some work for a company there ... they send me boards from time to time. In fact when I first started this stuff years ago and rang around offering my services ... they sent a pallet full of boards over for me to fix. That was an eye opener.
What a problem to have. Good for you.
There can certainly be disadvantages being out in the sticks, though we're not really that far from everthing ... just on the outskirts of a large country town. They claim it's a city but I'm not sure that's legit.
Probably the only thing I miss is that if I suddenly need a component I don't stock ... I won't find one here unless I drive to the city. I don't recall a time when I was ever that desperate ... and anyway if I order it from element14 or RS, I can have it the next day most times ... although they seem to be stocking less and less and their delivery times are dragging out too now.
Funny you should say that, it was beautiful down here today as well ... but still freezing in the workshop. Kept thinking as soon as I finish the system for the house, I need some for the workshop too.
Yep, must be the Scottish in us.
I was pleased to see the house stayed warm for the day with the tubes ... but the workshop certainly didn't. The last two days were pretty ordinary, though got a few hours warmth out of it ... but today was good again.Cheers, Roger
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 11:04pm 18 Aug 2021
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The way its done these days, first they erect the timber frame, then wrap the outside of that with building foil, shiny side on the inside. Then the brick is built up on the outside as a non structural facing.
If you request insulation in the walls, which few people even know is possible, then fibreglass bats would be installed from the inside before the plasterboard is fitted.
I believe these days, building regulations require insulation only in the ceiling, but not in the outer walls. Its not a common thing to do, and builders and architects are not very likely to suggest it. Both wish to build the lowest cost structure and could not care less about heating and cooling costs or comfort.Cheers, Tony.
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 11:25am 19 Aug 2021
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That does make sense ... but the house being built up the end of our street has a wooden frame and roof timbers etc ... and then today they started putting up the bricks. Definitely no foil or cladding of any kind behind their bricks in this case.
It's probably an SA thing ... we're a bit behind the times.
I've heard it mentioned often, so some must do it ... but I've never built a house so never had to even think about it.Cheers, Roger
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 03:19pm 19 Aug 2021
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Cheers, Roger
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 12:10am 20 Aug 2021
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There seems to be a pretty consistent and usable temperature gain every day. How is the big system coming along?
Building regulations seem to vary a lot from state to state. This is how its done in Victoria. Blue on the outside, highly reflective silver foil inside. The silver is supposed to reflect heat back inside, and the whole thing provides a vapor barrier to keep the damp out of the wooden frame.
Cheers, Tony.
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 02:36am 20 Aug 2021
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I believe here in NSlockup it's similar. There has to be sarking which is a foil under the roof and in the walls. I have seen some places being built with batt like material in the walls but I don't think that is a regulation.
There are some regulations here called BASIX, that mandate certain efficiency/ green agendas concerning water and greenhouse gas emissions primarily. They pertain to having a (useless) sized water tank, efficient gas hot water, solar. Taps, shower heads and crappers, double glazing, eaves over windows, air con and insulation. There are other things like swimming pools, garden and landscaping etc as well as building size that all need to be of a certain efficiency in the over all development.
You can pick and choose whatever combination to meet a certain point score. Incredibly, it leaves out solar PV or water heating. Don't want to step on the power co's profits too much do they? Usually the cheaper and easier/ faster to employ even if the less effective are the ones done.
I am aware that the insulation part covered in roof but not sure if it covers walls other than the very minimal standard which may be more to do with waterproofing/ Damp-coursing. At my other place where they built a monstrosity, they put a 1000L water tank at the back which wasn't even connected to anything. I don't remember them putting anything in the walls come to think of it, not surprising how slipshod that place was built but maybe it does not apply to brick? More likely the well known dodgy and multi times fined private certifier just took a kickback and signed off on whatever they wanted him to. Place still isn't actually approved even though it's been lived in for over 4 years thanks to a pathetically weak and corrupt council.
Round here they are building the houses in the estates with something they use in the US which is a glorified cardboard/ chipboard which is then concrete rendered. It's like 1/2 / 3/4" inch thick and slapped up in sheets. I don't know how waterproof it is but it's probably no great improvement on the old Fibro sheeting they used to use structurally and beneficently. Least in those days a home was made of hardwood not the weak as pine they use now.
I have seen where they are also doing some places in styrofoam. There is a HUGE mansion being built ( very slowly) at the end of the road behind us that is being covered in that. Mountains of styrofoam sitting round and being put up. I think they may be paying some attention to efficiency in that place. It's certainly against the grain of 99% of things being built round here and clearly price is not the prime consideration given it's massive size!
This is all waxed lyrical about including the average homes efficiency by 10% over the average but there is SO much more that could be done. For a start, why isn't EVERY home where feasible mandated to have solar? It could all be zero grid feedback if they wanted to roll out the overloaded crock of ship and / or just connected to the heating or Cooling systems and hot water.
Of course once again, the grubbermint don't want to risk political donations from the power industry and are pressured to keep their profits up so that obvious meaningful and significant saving and benefit is overlooked.
I'm no greenie by a long shot but it ticks me off that all this green crap is rammed down our throats and then we are insulted with half arsed garbage like this. It's all to make an appearance to address the environmental concerned zealots when the blinding obvious and properly effective is completely ignored in order to preserve the profitability of big business.
The giveaway with this BASIX crap is in the description where they state it is to lower heating and cooling costs for homeowners. Whenever you see ANYONE saying they want to decrease costs ( Big biz and gubbermint revenue) for anyone, you know it's a load of crap to start with.
( Steps down off soapbox)
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 02:54am 20 Aug 2021
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Mate of mine whom is very (sensibly) environmentally conscious that I used to make Biodiesel with renovated his home extensively about 10 years ago. Pulled out the bathroom and bedroom walls which surprised me at the time in being just the Timber frame on the brick then the plaster.
He put quality foil and then the batts in the north facing walls primarily to stop the summer heat. That was about 3/4 of the wall and the rest he planted hedging to shade it. Said it made a Huge difference. He also did a lot of the flooring in the place and found some insulation to go over the slab and then used this eco friendly Bamboo flooring which looked good and was also supposed to be insulative.
He had a Tube hot water system which he paid a Lot for at the time but took it down after a few years. He keeps meticulous records and monitors everything and he said there was little gain for him in it with the use of the Circ pump and the minimal benefit he got in winter. He did have a fair bit of shading from trees on the neighbours property in winter. He also put more insulation in the roof which he also researched carefully for it's true manufacturing impact and insulation value.
He replaced the Tube water heating with a larger PV system and said that was much better for him. He also put in carefully designed verandahs and decking and a few other things which decreased his energy use in his home over 50%.
It was bad efficiency wise to start with being another '70s project home which made it easier but was not that hard or expensive especially when much of the renos were planned anyway. He carefully researches everything and is never persuaded by hype. As enviro conscious as he is, he makes my disdain for it look like I'm an advocate. He too hates that so much is nothing more than a sales tool that does more harm than good.
Pity there aren't a lot more like him that look at reality not just want to Virtue signal.
johnmc Senior Member Joined: 21/01/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 282
Posted: 05:50am 20 Aug 2021
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The house that john had built much to the disgust of the builders.
50mm sheet foam placed under the concrete slab to a distance of 2 metre back from the perimeter.
The concreter was not impressed, especially as I watched to make sure that the insulating foam was inserted.
The brick layer also did not like my continuous inspection ,that the 2 inch foam sheet had been fitted between the double brick, outer walls .
The roof insulation was another drama, but after I showed the CSIRO suggested method and asked what was wrong , the roofing worker reply was but the sun reflects of the shinny aluminium cover on the rockwool insulation into their eyes
Thirty plus years later and we are still very happy with energy savings.
Morale do your own research and question the answers also remember that the builder wants good money so one should expect a qood job.
cheers johnjohnmc
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 08:52am 20 Aug 2021
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I think that would make a Huge difference to the comfort levels on it's own. The floor here in places can't be walked on with bare feet. I tried a couple of days ago in the ensuite and it was literally so cold it was painful.
I have seen places with foam blocks placed in the floor area that must have been at least 300mm Thick. I was told by someone that was more to take up uneven ground or movement. It would certainly be good for insulation but I have read that the edges of the slab need to be insulated as well and as you did, the insulation extended beyond the walls. What is on that 2M of Foam now? Did you put a verandah or something over it?
Yeah, I can imagine. The worst thing you could do is ask them to do a good job and employ skill and Diligence and put some effort into their work.
Must be nice and comfortable.
If I ever built, which I am not brave enough to do with the way tradies are these days, I would have pipes laid over the insulation in the slab for Hydronic heating. I probably would not go electric as the amount of power required for that is Huge and of course solar falls through the floor rather than heats it when you want it most so I would want space for a 40-50Kw system before I'd even consider electric only.
By having Hydronic, I would be able to use either a combustion boiler or an electric one or both. Just more flexibility that way and you would be able to pump in a lot more heat for a faster warm up if required with water than electric. I don't know it it would work or even be needed but may also be able to use the hydronic to cool the place in summer.
Seems to me that's asking far too much these days. I had the kitchen renod couple of years back. We wanted to re do the bathrooms as well but haven't got over that experience as yet.
Having a home built would require more bravery than I have in me.
johnmc Senior Member Joined: 21/01/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 282
Posted: 10:12am 20 Aug 2021
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No the foam extends towards the center of the house, as I believe the soil it self acts as a insulator when there is no continuous heat loss to the atmosphere' Getting ready for global cooling starting around 2030 cheers johnjohnmc
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 11:28am 20 Aug 2021
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Yes, still happy with the way it adds some heat most days.
Progress is pretty slow with the big one. I have all the tubes cut to length and last night I drilled and tapped all the holes to screw the floor into the cold inlet duct ... and my next job is to weld all the tubes into the angle.
I've set it up so I can sit up on a bench and do the welding horizontally.
A friend called last weekend and pointed out that the angle will bow when I put a lot of heat into it when welding. Suggested I use a length of solid steel and a spacer to bias the alum angle so that once it's welded and I take the clamps off it will still be straight. Mmmm ... hope I can pull that off.
Anyway, if I weld one in and then do the next one several feet away and jump all over the place it might not be so bad.
Last weekend was spent cultivating, mowing, slashing, with zero on the heater ... and this weekend is supposed to be an online seminar ... so not much is likely to be done either. Excuses, excuses!!
This is the cold duct set up with the floor inside and the cover behind it.
Figured it would be easier to set it up and drill and tap before it has all the tubes welded in ... which is fine for the floor ...
... but because there's a chance the angle will bow a little ... I'm still not game to drill the holes for the cover until it's been welded.
And my perch up on top of the bench where I'm gunna spend a few hours eventually ... long as I don't fall off.
I'm using the c-sections to help hold the tubes in place to keep the spacing correct ... but I've realised I need a better system.
I plan to get a couple lengths of timber ... drill holes through for the pipes ... rip the timbers down the centre ... then use them to clamp all the tubes together ...
... then leave that on each set of pipes until both assemblies are on the roof.
It should help hold them all in place and take a lot of strain off the welds when the assemblies are manhandled
Cheers, Roger
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 12:06pm 20 Aug 2021
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Hmm, interesting. I always though that the slab was ideally insulated from the soil. Thinking of it, I do believe you do have something there. I was making a furnace this week to melt some brass..... Out of Dirt.
I made one before. Ordinary soil in a 25L PLASTIC drum. I had about a 5" Hole in the middle, maybe 6 as I know the Crucible was 4" and I blasted some stupid heat in there and the plastic didn't come near melting and it was only 3-4" Of soil. It got hot after about an hour but still not enough to melt or even deform the HDPE.
I don't know if it would work the same with the prolonged exposure of the slab but then again, in the centre I would think there was more likely for the geo temp to come up than any heat loss to the earth.
For me, time I went 2 M in I'd probably do the whole floor. Might have to if I was doing hydronics anyway.
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 12:23pm 20 Aug 2021
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You are doing well Roger. It's a big project and it's not something you can just dedicate all your time to without doing anything else.
Easy to see there is a lot of work in it so just keep plodding away at it when you can and it will be done soon enough. I find when I relax and resolve myself to taking my time and it isn't going to happen in a day, things go much easier, I have less problems and it ends up coming together faster and with less problems than I expected.
I think your friends Caution and solution is very insightful as is not drilling the holes till it is welded.
I remember Welding one of the Chev Pumps I built as an oil collection pump years ago. I took a LOT of time and care to get it all lined up on the couplings dead straight with no binding before I set it on the frame. Taked it all up, perfect. Welded it, could barely turn the thing. Annoyed at my mistake I cut it off, re aligned and tacked it, all good, welded it again and binding up like no Tomorrow.
Being the rocket surgeon I am I did that 2 more times till I figured out, couldn't be me moving it and what was going on. I had seen that it always Binded the same way. Took it off again, misaligned the thing in the opposite direction with about the same binding, welded it and was perfect. I was later surprised when thinking about it the first couple of welds didn't take the movement out but obviously not.
Last time I did it I completely winged it to what I thought and turned out spot om. So much for being careful with the alignment before welding!
Also did that the other day on a burner. Carefully aligned a Joint, tacked it up and could already see the thing was warping. Ended up stitching the thing more than running beads and it came together OK. Not brilliant but the misalignment I was able to fill and seal with an over bead so good enough.
It is amazing how much welding can distort things. I bet they spend a lot of time addressing that in welding classes. Pity I never got any.
I think I have come up with a burner for my Veg heater. At this rate we will both be concluding our heating projects at about the same time.... Mid Summer!!
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 12:29pm 20 Aug 2021
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The place at the end of the street had the foundations dug in the pad and then I noticed a huge load of white polystyrene looking foam delivered there.
It seems it was used when they poured the foundations ... not sure exactly how coz there was a lot of it. The finished foundations and slab are pretty tall ... so maybe the foam allows a simpler foundation and is used to save on concrete.
That's awesome and good on you for sticking to your guns. It's obviously paid off for you.
Yes, that's our experience here too ... but you may remember I said a while ago that once the wood heater's been on for a few weeks that our floor tiles warm up.
Yesterday I took a video of my IR temp sensor as I walked from the front door right up to the fireplace.
Inside the front door the tiles were at 16.7 and by the end of the passage at the start of the kitchen, were 18.1.
Another 10 feet and up to 18.6 ... then over the next 12 feet to the tile in front of the heater it steadily rose to 24 degrees.
The heater was still warm at the front being early morning and the remnants of the overnight fire inside ... but no question the tiles do start to feel warmer (less cold) as you come up the passage.
That still encourages me to use any excess heat to pump into/onto the floor during the day because it must have the same effect as the wood heater eventually. At the moment, the tiles are simply being heated by radiant heat from the fire at night ... for a few feet ... and the rest by the warmer room air.
I was on the computer inside all day today and by three oclock I was starting to feel really warm. Had to take off my cardigan ... and then a while later my socks.
I checked the temperature and it was up to 24 in the kitchen ... and at my measurement spot in the lounge it was 24.7. From the data logger, it remained flat at 24.7 for 40 minutes.
And that was after a slow start with very little output until after 11am due to cloud and grey skys ... though our overnight temps had been mild and we only went down to around 19 degrees.
Haha ... that's funny. I still remember the constant insistance that we were entering a new ice age back when I was a teenager ... hah! And now I'm supposed to flip flop and crap myself that we're all going to cook to death.
Fool me once, shame on you ... fool me twice, shame on me!!!Cheers, Roger
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 01:31pm 20 Aug 2021
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I didn't see the Foundations of this place. It has a roof on it now and they are putting the Styro in or on the outside of the walls. The house is pretty far back from the road so I can't see exactly but you can definitely see the stryo in/ on the walls and plenty more to go of it. It appears to be more like blocks than sheets so they may be cladding the walls with it as I have seen is a thing now. If it's going in the walls the place will be insulated like no tomorrow.
Wonder what they put in the ceiling and if the walls are Double glazed? I did notice it had no verandah or larger size eves on the Substantial north wall which is now complete.
I have noticed our floor has been pretty consistent at around the low 18 degree mark. Does not seem to warm up with the room air but it sure cools down.
Yesterday was a deep frost here again and at some point, I think around 5, the dog opened the back door. She's great at opening it but never seen her close it behind her yet. I thought I heard it but was still too asleep to check. I got up just before 6 and found it open. The room was 16 and the floor was similar, well below normal temp. Maybe it was just the surface temp and it came back up after I shut the door but I didn't check later.
I went out on a job yesterday morning. Got down the road a bit and was starting to sweat. I looked at the heater and it was 23.5. I know it's pretty accurate but felt like 33. Outside was about 2 at that time so maybe it was the sudden change in temp or something but I had to turn it down and even 20 still felt warm.
Humans are very funny where temp is concerned.
Yeah, because it's supposed to get 2o Hotter by the time 90% of those living now are going to be dead anyway.
Funny thing is, I just planted a heap of seeds and put them on a heat mat to get the soil temp up to get them to germinate and grow stronger. Things grow much better in greenhouses where they are warm and often injected with extra Co2 which plants flourish on so why exactly are we panicking about conditions that are going to make the planet literally greener?
Not even twice. I haven't seen a single prediction on this in the last 20 years come near being right yet. Few years ago the Dams were never going to fill again according to the Chief alarmist.... err, scientist.
We have had 2 Floods here in the last 2 years because the dams have overfilled and washed down stream. Snow was supposed to be gone now in the alps. Apparently the only reason people haven't been able to Ski this season was because there was so much snow blocking roads and snowing everyone in, they couldn't get to the ski fields.
The coastlines were supposed to be disappearing and Islands wiped out till they proved with satellite Images the opposite was happening and the land masses were getting larger. Tide readings at fort Denison in Sydney harbour have shown water levels have risen all of 2 Pooteenths of nothing in the last 100 years. Bushfires are only caused by Globull warming even though the worst ones were last century and the highest recorded temps were still in the 1800's as well even though every time we do get a hot day the world is going to come to an end. Funny how they never make mention of record cold days in relation to globull boring isn't it?
It goes on and on and every time their fearmongering is debunked and proven wrong, they just come up with another spin and another alarmism to scare people with.
As they say, they can't get the weather prediction right for tomorrow or next Tuesday but we are supposed to believe they know what's going to happen in 100 years. Yeah, right!
rogerdw Guru Joined: 22/10/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 852
Posted: 08:25am 21 Aug 2021
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This one was also large blocks, definitely not sheets. Once the foudations and slab were finished I've seen no more foam.
The timber frames were put up and now the bricks are going up and very clearly no foam or sheeting or cover of any sort behind them and the frame.
I haven't measured them all that often, but ours certainly vary more than I expected.
I wish mine worked that well. I set mine to max (31) when I do the school run in the mornings ... and by the time I'm home it's almost warm enough!!!
Exactly. I definitely have trust issues when it comes to weather 'scientists' and any other extremists.Cheers, Roger
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 01:29am 22 Aug 2021
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You obviously don't drive a Euro car then, not that mine is. The best one for a heater I ever came across was my W123 300D Mercs. I do not know how those things got good cabin heat so fast. You could drive down the road 1 Minute and got meaningful heat out the things. The irony was, you could start and idle them for 5 Min and still hold your hand on the exhaust manifold!
How they got cabin heat so fast was beyond me. The 405 Pug I had also had a good heater, that would blow the fires of hell but wasn't as fast on the initial heat up but still bloody good.
The current GLA is good but the seat heaters are better. Dad and I were in the country a few years back where it was -8 one morning. We didn't get from the middle to the edge of the small town till our arses were on fire. Then having not used them before we damn near burnt ourselves trying to figure out how to shut the damn things off. NOTHING is straight forward, logical or in the place you would expect on a recent merc..... But hey, you can have 16 Different colours of lights in the footwells and that's what's really important right? Oh, and don't worry about the near $700 the stealer wanted for another battery that was going to take 2 weeks to get from Melbourne.
Went over the road to the Tyre place and got the equivalent battery for just over $200.
The one I was Driving was the old Subaru outback. Just a run around car that some woman traded in after blowing the crap out of the engine after The oil light cam on and just wanted to get it another 20 Km home. Had another engine out of a smashed one laying round I threw in and it's been a surprisingly good car. Only wanted it as a Hacker to drive round in I don't have to worry about it getting dinged or dented in carparks unlike the Merc and I'm very happy and relaxed driving it for that reason. Tee heater is good, the AC is great, the sunroof don't work like I give a damn and it cost me bugger all. Perfect!
Does your car have a thermostat in it? If not that could be why it takes so long to get the heater going?
They never get of these predictions right and their track record could not be worse nor their logic and claims any more flawed. IF their forecasts were as were as accurate as their excuses for never getting anything right are as forthcoming, they might be taken more seriously.
On that note, we have had a great run of weather this last week or so. Today is supposed to hit 26, tomorrow 13 and wet. That is going to be an acclimatisation shock. Not all together disappointed though, only that we are only supposed to get 8mm. To me, hasn't even rained till you get 10mm. Their predictions tend to be on the light side here so doubt we will get that.
The ground is getting very dry and hard with cracks everywhere. Hard to believe we got 150mm in one day in Feb and over 450MM in 5 days. Where my father is on the Mid north coast he's still not game to take the tractors in the paddocks for fear of bogging them. The rain has not let up there more than a few days at a time most of the year! More globull warming where it will never rain again.
The big temp change could be a situation where the water tank system could be handy. If I could get that up to 25, and then pull the heat back out tomorrow to 20, that could be worthwhile.
A 25o ambient day would really give your tubes something to work with and if the next day was cool, you would be able to get some residual heat in the house.
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 02:48am 22 Aug 2021
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As a one time student pilot, and living on weather stations for a couple of years (in the Antarctic) weather forecasting is actually quite good if you bother to study all the available information and interpret it correctly.
The trouble is, people expect a single sentence forecast to cover every inch of a very large state, or even the whole of Australia. Weather conditions can be totally different on the opposite sides of a single mountain only a few miles apart.Cheers, Tony.
Davo99 Guru Joined: 03/06/2019 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1578
Posted: 06:23am 22 Aug 2021
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Yes, I'm sure some do but forecasts are given for quite specific localities now and greater areas don't even come near what they predict. I have many times seen the greater sydney area or sections up and down the coast not even come close to what they predicted in any part.
You can look on the BOM site and see differing forecasts for different areas in Sydney and anywhere else so if they break it up, it's reasonable to expect they should be accurate for the area they are talking about let alone the entire area within a 50km+ radius of the CBD where they take base the predictions from Observatory hill.
Nice location that. I'd like to go for a Picnic there again if we ever get out of lockup.
I completely agree with what you say there as I have seen it endless times. It's a very frequent occurrence where my father is for whatever reason. You can go 5 Km from where he is and get the completely opposite weather conditions. Not a drop of rain where he is and sunny and near floods down the end of the road. No mountains where he is either.
I can certainly make allowances for that but when they say all the surrounding areas literally out to 100Km are going to be this or that and NO one sees that weather at all, that's the sort of errors I'm talking about.
I find the biggest discrepancy is with predicted rainfall. The times they say rain that does not happen anywhere in an area is far too often for me to always just happen to be in the area that misses it.
I am left to wonder if they lean to the side of saying it will rain when it won't? I'm sure they would get less complaints if they say it's going to rain and it does not than if they say it will be fine and does rain.
One stupid thought I have had since a kid was how much money you could make if you could predict weather accurately a year in advance. People would pay a lot to know the event they were planning was going to be wet or fine, to organise parts of construction projects around, when they could drain dams or reserves knowing when they would be topped up again etc.
One could be VERY wealthy selling that sort of information if it could be relied on.
It hit 27 here today. Higher than they said but no one will complain about that! See how they go tomorrow when it's supposed to be 13 and wet.
Oh, they have changed it again Minutes ago.
Now it's supposed to be 26 With 25MM of rain and Tuesday 13 with up to 70 MM.
Honestly, how can anyone count on these predictions when they vary that wildly in a few hours? If I could rely on that I'd go drop my water tanks and re fill them with the rain but How can I know I won't be left with bugger all.... again?
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