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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Problem with 'OPTION LCDPANEL CONSOLE'
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Mixtel90 Guru  Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6787 |
I understand what the problem *is*, but not why anyone would want to do this. The 320x240 ILI9488 is very poor as a console at the best of times. Increasing the font size gains nothing in that respect as it's still too slow to be of any use. The scrolling isn't done in hardware and its still scrolled pixel by pixel. The primary use for a large font on such a display is to display numeric values, where the text length is usually less than ten characters or so. The user sees this, but there's no need for the programmer to be stuck with the same restriction. Whether it's a "bug" if something fails when it's being used outside its normal capabilities is questionable. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 4039 |
I'm probably not one to talk but could we avoid such confrontational language with regards to something that is provided for free and maintained as a hobby activity ? Neither Peter nor anyone else has any obligation to do anything nor care what anyone else thinks. As it happens I looked at a related issue a couple of year ago; supporting commands at the MMB4L prompt that stretched more than the console width. At least at that time I came to the conclusion that whilst I probably could get it working (including backspace/home/end) there were more entertaining things to do with my life. YMMV, Tom Edited 2024-02-29 19:33 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2350 |
when i first played around with a picomite VGA a couple of months back, i struck the same issue Frank has experienced within half an hour. this was before i'd even entered a program into the picomite. after a while i managed to work out what was going on, and then reported the problem on this forum. the responses i got back kind of implied i was an idiot; this upset me, but i chalked it up to the 'typical forum experience'. now Frank has discovered the same problem. yes, mmbasic is free, and yes it is maintained by volunteers (well, pretty much one volunteer), but at the same time i (and others) would like to see the mmbasic ecosystem flourish, and this necessitates a polished, user-friendly product. i have been involved with mmbasic for over 10 years now, and invested many hundreds of hours into trying to 'spread the word'. but the present issue (as i call it, a design flaw, albeit in one specific component) does put a major dent into the efforts of those of us who are trying to grow the ecosystem. mmbasic w/VGA (and USB keyboard) on the pico has a certain 'cool' aspect, and many great points, but every 'gotcha' that the user encounters detracts tenfold from the positive aspects. and it does not take much for a first-time-user to hit a roadblock and just walk away. this is why i use confrontational language, to try and 'encourage' removing of those roadblocks, because if i and others say nothing (or are 'excessively polite') it will not be long until the picomite mmbasic ecosystem withers. cheers, rob. |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9115 |
Rob Your approach and contention that everything is "easy" without enough knowledge to know and normally being completely wrong is exactly the reason I try to avoid ever doing anything you suggest but at the same time do my best to support pretty much everyone else. Hopefully this bug and the general lack of polish will mean you won't be using the PicoMite family and I won't have to put up with your "suggestions" in the future. |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2350 |
said with such eloquence... |
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| Amnesie Guru Joined: 30/06/2020 Location: GermanyPosts: 396 |
Hello, I also follow rob's thoughts. Sorry, but I don't get why this "language" is some kind of confrontational. He states out that: And it is. YES MMBASIC is free and it is an INCREDIBLE piece of work, especially Peter put into all this - NO question about that. But does all of this mean that we are not even allowed to criticize or question anything? When I asked a question (about power saving option via sleep mode of the pico), I was also accused of making innuendos of Peter, than I just gave up on replying. To be honest I was a bid annoyed. English isn't my native language and maybe there are misinterpretations, too. But only because of something is free one can not criticize or question anything - this is the moment something went wrong here. Just my two cents... |
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| Amnesie Guru Joined: 30/06/2020 Location: GermanyPosts: 396 |
What the heck? Sorry Peter that's really badly worded! All credit to your achievements, but that's arrogant. |
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| Frank N. Furter Guru Joined: 28/05/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 828 |
Oh my goodness! I've kicked something loose! Be sensible again! Yes, I also stumbled across the problem in the first half hour and have now solved it with 'OPTION RESET'. The simplest thing would be to disallow fonts that are too large as console fonts... I just tried out the fonts and didn't expect that I wouldn't be able to undo it... @Mixtel90: I don't agree with you on that. Yes, the scrolling is very slow but mostly still acceptable. The LCD size is just about big enough for me. My first PocketPC with Windows Mobile 2003SE didn't have a larger display either. I will post soon what I have built... - That's my little DREAM COMPUTER  Be nice to each other again!!! Frank |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9115 |
That's a good idea. I'll put a block on any font/scale combination that would result in a display width less than 30. That way OPTION LCDPANEL NOCONSOLE or OPTION LCDPANEL CONSOLE n would both always be available |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6787 |
All this stems from Frank's requirement for a large font on a small LCD screen when using it as a console. So far no-one has given me any idea whatsoever why he wants this. 320x240 on a software-scrolled SPI display isn't particularly useful as a console - that's been proved already. There are 76,800 pixels to scroll as soon as the cursor reaches the bottom line of the screen. The display is always in graphics mode - it can't be anything else. It's not like scrolling text on a text display. Now, it *may* be possible to get something that *looks like* what he's after using graphic commands, but without having any more info further discussion is moot. Using the display as the console isn't the answer. The correct answer is that you make sure that you *don't* use such a big font for any *console* display (LCD or VGA). If that means error traps in your program to reset the font then so be it. If you insist on not doing this then accept that you may end up having to wipe the flash to get out of it. Once again, the user should never see the console so there is rarely any requirement for a large font in it. --------------- The Micromite has no console or display modes. It is strictly an embedded controller and the serial terminal is only intended to be a way to program it and then be disconnected. It's not something for a user to see and it shouldn't be used as such. ---------------- Sorry Frank, posts crossed. :) Edited 2024-02-29 21:46 by Mixtel90 Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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phil99 Guru Joined: 11/02/2018 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2135 |
Frank was just trying things out, like everyone does with a new toy. |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9115 |
NB: As suggested by disco4now early in the thread, there is no need to do anything complex to get out of this issue. Just use FONT 1 'or anything small enough OPTION DEFAULT FONT 1 |
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| lizby Guru Joined: 17/05/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 3150 |
This has been mentioned several times. Is there such a thing? All the ILI9488s that I have bought, and all that I see on Aliexpress, have been 480x320 (which, by the way, I find quite decent as a console even if slowish). I'm not sure why a 320x240 ILI9488 would be preferable to an ILI9341. PicoMite, Armmite F4, SensorKits, MMBasic Hardware, Games, etc. on fruitoftheshed |
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| Frank N. Furter Guru Joined: 28/05/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 828 |
...I tried that too and it didn't work. Now I've tried it again and it works!!!  No idea why it didn't work during the first test...  Frank |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6787 |
A 480x320 would obviously be even slower to scroll as there are 153,600 pixels.... I've never had a ILI9488 so I don't know the resolutions available. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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stanleyella Guru Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2129 |
I have one and afaik they're 480x320 and need a diode and resistor to use miso. |
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| lizby Guru Joined: 17/05/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 3150 |
I don't know why someone who doesn't even have an ILI9488 would repeatedly speculate about how slow it is despite evidence that people are using it and finding it suitable to their needs. Not sure how fast is fast enough, but this is scrolling with PgUp and PgDn: ILI9488 as LCD console PicoMite, Armmite F4, SensorKits, MMBasic Hardware, Games, etc. on fruitoftheshed |
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| stanleyella Guru Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2129 |
is this correct? I use picomite vga usb v5.09.00b3 and usb keyboard control c stops running code,there's no vga usb keyboard response after. use earlier version to see if a prob? |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6787 |
Any SPI display, unless it has specific hardware scrolling, is at the mercy of the fact that it's on a serial display. Some of the displays have hardware scrolling but only in portrait mode. Note - I said scrolling, not moving by using page up/down. That isn't scrolling, it's block copy. Move the cursor down one row of pixels at the bottom and you have to scroll every pixel on the screen upwards by one row. It doesn't matter what resolution the display is - higher resolutions have more pixel rows to move so will scroll slower. A parallel display is something else entirely. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| lizby Guru Joined: 17/05/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 3150 |
A truism. If one can move quickly through a document in the editor with PgUp and PgDn (and Home and End), and move with the arrow keys to any character position on the screen, then the SPI speed is not going to be much of an impediment if one is happy with the ILI9488 screen size. If one is not, we aren't short of choices. PicoMite, Armmite F4, SensorKits, MMBasic Hardware, Games, etc. on fruitoftheshed |
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