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Forum Index : Solar : Solar Farm Practicallity
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| anteror Senior Member  Joined: 06/10/2009 Location: FinlandPosts: 189 |
There is A PERFECT war going on.. 
Lives not lost, but the uncertainty and tension has been REALLY  achieved, enough.., so that the arms trade to flourish once again.
(What do Russians do with this tiny piece of land..  )
So, the question here and NOW from something else and you know it. Weapon business.(also futures in stock market and value of money etc  ..)
BUT back to "our" bisnes; I just had a long discussion with my friend who first ordered 5kw and then 20kw wingenerator from; http://www.huayaturbine.com/ Earlier mentionede as "Exmork" windgenerator.. This 20kw unit is working very good and producing. He gets 80-100Kwh energy from very low winds per day and WHEN its windy he gets 100-400Kwh per day. This 20kw unit has several and good protective functions. First it makes more load, but if that is not enough, it turns the rudder, more and in stormy weather, with the VERY safe manner in accordance with the laws of physics. My friends older boy also built house near and energy from this 20kw unit is guided there, also. In Finland we do not get any reasonable feed in tariff from small wind, nor solar. My friend has system, to feed the grid, but it has system made by Siemens, to use everything to own use by the grid.. It has several opportunities and automatically switches the power to a big 3000l water charger, mass heater, to older boys hause water charger etc You can choose which ones are the prime targets, for wind power etc, with this Siemens system. With this system you use your own wind power, connected to the grid and usual system.. All the power from wind or solar comes to your house and own use. You use grid, only when there no wind nor solar. Not bad at all
I know we have these 20Kw units several here in Finland. Also 30kw units. I know everybody who have these and been working good. We have hundreds of 5Kw units and thousands of 2-3Kw units. Their neighbors became interested and after that their neighbors etc This all started here in Finland after I started to write to many forums here, after my testing and real facts about this. When I wrote to these forums here in Finland, I wrote with my own name and telephone number. I think, that is the way to get something real, here in the internet. I have thousands of contacts, during the years. In every contact I have made my best, to make people understand.. I have never received any profit, this is volunteer work. I am a retired shop keeper.. in the third generation. NEVER  , I have got better profit or satisfaction from my work as
now ! Antero |
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yahoo2 Guru  Joined: 05/04/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1166 |
I saw a micro brewer in the telly with a 96Kw solar install and he thought is was the best thing since malted barley and it had made a massive difference to their business. I noticed that it was completely funded through a five year lease where you retain ownership of the asset at the end, I am guessing it is through the same companies that finance farm machinery. Seems I am not the only one who thinks the big power companies are scrambling to shore up their income. The conversation - Big Solar the conversation- electricity war I'm confused, no wait... maybe I'm not... |
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norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
Well I`ve reached a fork in the road I did not think I`d even consider. I`ve been approached by a Company who are looking for sites like mine, with sun and HV grid on tap. I really wanted this to be a goer with local money, no government money but I am asking myself just how much I want a backyard of solar panels. I can sit back and just take the lease and maintenance money, watch the construction but the invasion of my land. I dunno!!!! For the promotion of solar up here in the north, do I take this? What do 4M members think they`d do? We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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Bryan1 Guru Joined: 22/02/2006 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1344 |
Eh Vic, Just put a clause in the contract to where you get a free tap off the pv array and retire happy in the thought you never need to worry about RE power again and get enough $$$ off the lease to enjoy a pub crawl when the urge hits....... |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Hi Vic.. First, spend $200 and go see a good laywer. Tell him the proposition. Then he has to work our the term of contract, any special clauses,(like bryan said). he'll possibly link the return to you based on the cpi ,land valuation, your maintenance of the property,Etc. Also , he'll take into consideration , family ,(divorce)-been there ,done that..ouch. and ,if you decide to sell the property , can you sub-divide,and retain that real estate bit,probably no!.. superannuation ,, can you set up a supperannuation fund in your/family name with the income. Taxation,capital gains tax ,Etc. I'd give it a go --just never,ever think these guys are "Father Christmas" See a lawyer,repeat that to yourself..... Bruce Bushboy |
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| Bryan1 Guru Joined: 22/02/2006 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1344 |
More like gotta pay that scumbag gotta pay that scumbag and don't let him think he's a leach |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
Bryan & Bruce, Solicitor in the loop, gotta go with that. Amazing one of the negatives I got from going local was the investors questionable tenure on other owners land, but I guess that was a way out, yet companies have got that down to pat, no drama. Yeh Father Christmas with horns, claws and a bunch of wild scrubbers for reindeers. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| M Del Senior Member Joined: 09/04/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 155 |
Hi Vic, several things to consider. Lots will depend on the status of your attempt so far. 1, do they already have a supply contract in waiting? Did they give you any idea if it is just a proposal, or are they ready to move dirt when they secure a site? 2, have you got anywhere with your proposal? Or are you still beating your head against bureaucracy? It is likely they already have approval papers waiting for final details and cash payments to the relevant pencil pushers. 3, what interest have you got from people in your local area? Has anyone made any sort of commitment to support your plan? Are people waiting to see how it goes and climb on board once it is up and running? These things go a lot easier when councils and regulators are dealing with companies and operators they know rather than someone trying to get in on the bottom rung. ie, you building a house v a developer building flats. Also they are less stringent with enforcing the regs when it is a large company they do lots of business with. They may have a minimum 500kw stated connection requirement, they would hold you to it, but allow a large player to start at a level a lot lower than that and build up over time. ie, they could start at 100kw, get connected and add more blocks in stages as funding is sorted. Sort of like dust limits at mines, all guarantees of nil or minimal dust, but the EPA refuse to enforce breaches and then stop you from taking independent action. I back getting your own legal in, just make sure the lawyer has a good understanding of contract law and has no possible connection to the mob with the proposal. edited some bad spelling Mark |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
I have not been having any drama with the bueaocrazies, not got that far, as have hit a big snag, there is very little positive local interest, thus it appears the only way is to go with a Company. As yet said Company is only looking. I have as yet not agreed to their proposal at my site, am chasing the negatives before committing, I was hoping to build it for local customers with local money and no government subsidies, and am hoping the Company interest may get them off the fence. The figures show it is a viable business proposition. Early days still. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| yahoo2 Guru Joined: 05/04/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1166 |
Bit of a rant from Nigel Morris. I dont think he was a happy camper when he wrote this. Puts a few things in perspective, although its more than a little depressing. The great australian electricity ripoff I'm confused, no wait... maybe I'm not... |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
Well I endured and tried to understand Nigel`s "resistance" and I guess reading between the lines, his future business hopes are a wee shattered by this govts "winding back the RET". One govt gives another takes away. 
I don`t doubt there is heaps of graft and corruption in the power industry, and would love to see solar farms be a practical solution but not one supported by graft and corruption, which govt subsidies introduce. Let solar stand on its own feet, I believe it can do that right now in some applications and more so in the future with technology gains. In relation to Alcoa closing aluminium refineries, by googling you`ll find Rio Tinto is building a solar farm to partially replace diesel generation of power at Weipa FNQ. Initially I thought finally solar in NQ, but reading on, again it is subsidised by the tax payer. Did Rio threaten to close Weipa? My apologise Gizmo, politics is part of the practicality of Solar, who knows what we pay in reality for each Kwhr of fossil fuel power if subsidies were removed. Perhaps Solar is well and truly undercutting that figure already. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Vic I fully agree that solar could stand on its own and would do it better without government intervention as so called help, it is like the ATO arriving at your business and saying "we are here to help you" what is needed is to remove the restrictive practices legislated by government for the benefit, protection of the generation industry, and allow coops to generate their own electricity and put in their own limited area distribution networks. While we are forced to use existing infrastructure belonging to government and other investors we have to cap in hand to them and say please sir, please sir,we are under commercial duress which is by the way illegal, if we did it we would be in court in a flash. If solar power producers cannot do that they are better to buy a trawler and go broke there and not get solar a bad name. Off soapbox. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
Everyone has a political status weather they know it or not some try to hide from it others are scared of it. Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
It is true, we all have a political status, but I do not wish to convey my political status, just present the trials and tribulations of my attempt to get a solar farm going, Nigels view helped present a major stumbling block. My aim is simply to inform 4M members as I become "enlightened" to the pitfalls of my crazy project. If by doing so I offend some, please understand that is not my intent. I have found this thread the only bright light in a sea of negativity. There is very little understanding of solar in my community but heaps on the 4M. That may sound "gooey" but is as I see it. I keenly look forward to the day, however unlikely it may seem, publishing on this 4m photos of construction. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| yahoo2 Guru Joined: 05/04/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1166 |
I have had a look at some his more recent writings, he is worried that these large power providers have become unprofitable purely through their own gamesmanship and the irritation it causes power consumers. The $billions that have been spent on network infrastructure on the assumption that the cost (plus a tidy profit) could be easily passed on to consumers is just not happening. Privately funded energy is eroding their market share. The Renewable energy juggernaut is just not stopping. I think not supporting local solar farms has been a massive PR and financial mistake. If there is a hint of a financial bailout needed to prop some of these power companies up there will be a lot of instability in the market and customers will not see that in a good light. That will not be good for anybody. That could be the trigger for business clients to install some solar capacity and manage their power usage throughout the day with these new inverter systems some automation controls and an import only connection. Perhaps there are not enough retirees around you norcold. They have been the big drivers here. I spoke to a couple last weekend that have just fitted solar, their exact words were. "We got offered a deferred finance plan with no strings, we couldn't afford not to do it". I also got handed some info on the new hybrid diesel trucks that are due for release, it kinda stunned me, I never saw that coming. Makes perfect sense now that I think about it. Just shows you never quite know what will happen in the future. I'm confused, no wait... maybe I'm not... |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
Bugger all retirees here, just staid farmers. Hybrid diesel trucks, please elaborate you`ve got me frothing at the mouth. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| yahoo2 Guru Joined: 05/04/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1166 |
Not much to tell really. Hino Hybrid A number of Asian brands have them for sale. Aimed at the delivery truck market I guess? I'm confused, no wait... maybe I'm not... |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
Just an update, nothing happening on my solar farm "dream" up north here and nothing likely, but a number of farmers have installed 30Kw systems, as has a local car dealer and Hotel owners. One farmer in particular has applied to Ergon to extend his 30Kw system to 100Kw. I think as Bob has pointed out rooftop solar is the way OZ will go, costs below half of what solar farm solar do, per watt . Highest costs are the supporting structure, with associated engineering with the hook up to the HV line costing almost as much as the panels. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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| M Del Senior Member Joined: 09/04/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 155 |
Hi Vic Looks like the solar farm is turning into several smaller farms. Are these people you had been talking to about the "solar farm dream"? If they are then it has started, just not the way you planned? Mark |
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| norcold Guru Joined: 06/02/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 670 |
No, they are not people I`ve spoken to, so far I`ve drawn a blank there. With the high capability of solar in our region, they are paying the way and will do so even without subsidies, rooftop solar that is. Unfortunately because they are not 24/7 producers, I can understand power utilities not encouraging them even at 4cents/kW/hr feed-in. We come from the land downunder. Vic |
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