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Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 10:12pm 30 Jan 2018
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Well I'm not in the dark yet....
Mains out 15 minutes ago & keeping a 1300W load up; only 500 from the panels ATM, the rest from the Honda.
All IT gear up + 3 extra laptops. 3 fridges all going, just no Aircon yet.
The AC charging did have a big hit on the Honda, as the inverter decided to push 8.5A into the batteries after the 30 second changeover.
Genny gives a rev whenever one of the fridges kicks in..
Main place I don't have power is the front office where I work on client PC's.
Cheers
Phil.
Might update this thread occasionally for the hell of it.
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 12:17am 31 Jan 2018
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Got brave at 11:00 and turned on the Aircon...
Peaked the load total load up to 2700W, but the panels are now able to contribute 1800W of that. Ran for about 5 mins before the load on the Genny dropped to about 150W.
A/C is only set at 29°C, but have enough head room to sneak it down slowly.
Phil
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 08:23pm 31 Jan 2018
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Well all was good till around mid day when it started clouding over.
At first the batteries buffed the clouds a bit, but then hit a bit for charge when the sun reappeared.
Office UPS was working overtime.
Game was all over by 1:00, around 500W of solar was all that was left; no more air con from there in.
All up for the outage the Honda produced 3.85kWh, the Solar made 8, but wouldn't have cut the job alone (even without A/C attempt).
Loads I saw on the Honda varied from 150 to 1400W, but mostly sitting around the 700W mark.
Fuel for the day was spot on 4 litres; RON 98 @ $1.559 AMT.
Not exactly cheap power, working out at $1.62/kWh.
Interesting exercise.
Cheers
Phil.
PS. Power Factor on the Energy Meter plugged into the Genny sat mostly around 0.76. That surprised me a bit.
Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498
Posted: 09:03pm 31 Jan 2018
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Yeah, you can't buy fuel and beat the price of grid power.
Is there a setting in the inverter for setting the generator as priority over the solar or something like that? You may have been better to split the loads between the generator and the inverter.
Those inverters are not as good as they could be, the one I used to have would not let me charge my FLA batteries properly as it said the voltage was too high and shut down. There are better ones that work in nicely with a generator but they cost a lot more too.There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't.
George65 Guru Joined: 18/09/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 308
Posted: 09:13pm 31 Jan 2018
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Good to know it works at least. I think it's better to have power at that price than not. After all, was only for a day and you would have lost more in productivity if you didn't have it.
I can only remember one blackout at my old place in the last 10 years we were there. I had the genny out so fast and plugged in so the mrs Could watch TV and have some lights she barely knew there was no power. Had to justify why I had all this stuff.
Was really good when the neighbour came down couple of hours later to see why we had power and the rest of the street was in blackness. The comment and indignation that if the power wasn't back on by the morning I would HAVE to run a wire up to her because It wasn't fair we had power and she didn't was surprising and somewhat rude and demanding I thought.
I hear blackouts are more frequent here which is good, up to 2 a year I'm told! Perfect justification for the new lister 12/2 I have bought with the 6Kw head. No fuel costs with that one, will be run on used veg oil same as all my diesels.
Glad you got through the outage ok and thanks for posting. Interesting info.
Mulver Senior Member Joined: 27/02/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 160
Posted: 01:03am 01 Feb 2018
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George, Do you have a link to the lister Chinese copies you've mentioned are not so bad?
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 04:59am 01 Feb 2018
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I can only remember the last 1/2 dozen here, vaguely....
In October thru to December; So many of them they blur into insignificance.
If there's more than one connect retry, you can be sure it's out of a bare minimum of 45 minutes white there's a response.
2 & 3 hour outages are not uncommon.
The 2kV Honda lives permanently in the Bbq area, chained to a post & ready to go.
Had a 1kV Honda EU10i for 15 years before this one, primarily bought for camping. Used to tip 40 to 50 litres thru it during 2 week trips.
Was reluctant to replace it as changes to out camping practices; 250W of Solar, better lighting etc had got our fuel usage on the trips down to 0 to 10 Litres, dependant on the weather.
Only incentive to upgrade it was the increased usage as office/house backup, pushed the 1kV close to it's limit.
Phil.
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 05:03am 01 Feb 2018
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Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498
Posted: 06:17am 01 Feb 2018
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I have a Lister 8KW Diesel that uses 3 litres per hour at full chat, that still will cost $0.50 per KWH for Diesel. 25 Years ago I used quite a bit of Diesel for generating power and got a rebate, I am not sure if that still applies.
AC Source as Generator will divert generator power through to output, I think you will find that inverter will either run everything off DC from batteries and solar or from the generator and charge at the same time but will not combine solar with the generators power.
Lightweight high revving petrol generators are made for convenience. Upgrade your solar and kiss power bills goodbye.
We have had 2 blackouts in the last year that were longer than 24 hours due to storms. I had power while the neighbours were in the dark or had noisy generators running. My next door neighbour still had her fridge and few basics running from my solar power.Edited by Madness 2018-02-02There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't.
George65 Guru Joined: 18/09/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 308
Posted: 08:42am 01 Feb 2018
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No Chinese Listers I am aware of.
The lister Copys ( listeroids) come out of India. Theya re all really an asembly of parts and are best considered kit engines.
I have a century. It's crap. all the typical problems. Was full of casting sand, lifters didn't rotate but worst of all, it is so out of balance it bounces around like a jackhammer. Tried everything to balance it to no avail so I am going to have to do it the proper hard way, remove the flywheels ( with Gib keys probably put in with a sledge hammer, literally) balance them to each other then balance them to the engine. I know one flywheel is way off because the thing wants to turn circles round itself.
Some of the less bad brands are metex, Vidhata, Vijay, Anand and Field marshal. More depends on your dealings with the supplier than the average quality. If you are buying one used, well you take what you get and fix it as required. parts are cheapo and very readily available.
My own preference for practicality however is the Chinese horizontal engines. They come air or water cooled and run perfect straight out the box. They tend to be more noisy than the Roids running an average of 2600 RPM but You can, despite flawed folk law, over size and slow them down. The things pull like trains and go forever.
I have a 3HP 165 model that will outpull any 5-6Hp engine I have and by a good margin. Bought a 5.5 170F a while back. had it running today but haven't loaded it yet. waiting for the brother in law to turn me up a shaft and bore a pulley for the thing. Don't know why I ask him. For less than $50 I could probably take them to a machine shop and have them back in days instead of months from him.
All the china Diesels are good and come in all sorts of flavors from the little 165's like I have in air or water cooled right up to the 30HP monoliths that weigh more than most car engines. They all come water and aircooled, electric start and a bunch of other available add ons including generators and mounted on trolleys. Hope to find one of them one day.
Both the roids and the China Horozontals run fine on used veg oil and I talk to a guy regularly whom has run his on " Sump gunk" as he calls the used engine oil he gets. He does run water injection on the things but he loggs up decent hours on his 2 Roids every day. I run mine on veg mostly.
I did pull the head off the little 165 after a good ryun on veg and some water spray down the intake and couldn't believe how clean the thing was inside. If I hadn't done it myself and someone was trying to sell it to me, I would not have believed they didn't polish the top of the piston with a rag.
If I ever do go off grid, the Diesels fueled by veg oil will be a big part of my setup.
George65 Guru Joined: 18/09/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 308
Posted: 08:49am 01 Feb 2018
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Boppa Guru Joined: 08/11/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 814
Posted: 09:00am 01 Feb 2018
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I'd beleive it, I went camping a couple of months ago and one of the tents had a quite large (and bloody noisy) genpack going... I wondered what they had in a tent that would require that much power (it was an older yamaha 5kw genpack, the one with wheels at one end so you can move it)
Turns out- they had a bloomin AIRCONDITIONER in there- a full sized window rattler!!!
In a tent!!!
Thats camping?
Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498
Posted: 09:51am 01 Feb 2018
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Last time I went camping one 180 watt panel and single battery kept the phone charged and powered lights. Must be something wrong with me.There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't.
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 10:27am 01 Feb 2018
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Very Simple....
When at home the Boat's about 20m from the back door, but not a lot of water apart from what's in the Spa.
Camping/Glamping gets it 20' from the door in a 60 acre puddle, AND no question of what time we are going home.....
Phil.
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 10:29am 01 Feb 2018
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You may not need a Hair Straightener & Blow dryer.... (Not that I do either).
Phil.
Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498
Posted: 11:20am 01 Feb 2018
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I forgot the pump for the shower, blow dryer is wasted on me.
Made this a couple years ago from an expired 9KG gas bottle (make sure you take precautions), works brilliantly. I cut the top out just where it bends at the top of the straight section, drilled the holes in it, they need to be 20 mm, too small and they clog up. Cut the holes etc in the bottom part, put the top part inside upside down and tapped it down to sit on the weld in the middle, welded it in 3 spots. I made it based on the design of the Asian cooking stoves made from some type of clay.
It lights easy and burns really well and does not need a lot of fuel, works well with charcoal too. Put a couple pieces of pipe across the top to rest a pot on. A wok just sits on it. If you want to cook spuds or corn you can wrap it in foil and stick in the ash chamber.
Edited by Madness 2018-02-02There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't.
George65 Guru Joined: 18/09/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 308
Posted: 02:45pm 01 Feb 2018
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Just to clarify, you know that wasn't directed at you right? Don't want to seem rude to you even if it was to the twit with 4 Generators I did ask! :0)
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 08:10pm 01 Feb 2018
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Meanwhile he's thinking "You don't know what it takes to get the SO out of the house.
I bucked at upgrading the Eu10i, as it way exceeded the camping needs once the solar was added. Much easier to lug at 12kg than the Eu20 at 22kg, but needed the backup potential.
Interestingly, I paid $1800 for it in 2000, advertised it for $750 in 2016. Replacement cost at the time was $1400.
Sold it to a small engine mechanic in a neighbouring town. Around 3000 hours.
Buyer was expecting me to 1/2 the price based on age & hours.
Guy turns up, points out it's old....
Says he's a mechanic & asks if he can inspect it.
Checks the oil, air cleaner & plug & comments it's cold & hasn't been run very recently.
Gives it a slow pull to check the compression then a second to start it.
Asks if I'd take $700; Deal done.
Only one trick in the sale & that was my past history of always fuelling it from 10L containers of PULP, & giving it an oil change as each 10L passed, about 20-30 hours.
Little thing oil held 240ml of oil and it was totally it's best friend.
Phil.
Phil23 Guru Joined: 27/03/2016 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1664
Posted: 08:17pm 01 Feb 2018
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Did something vaguely similar some year back, but must have been about a 30kg cylinder.
Split it roughly length wise & hinged a section as a lid & stuck it on legs.
Different intended purpose though, intended more as a roasting oven to be left permanently at the location we frequent.
Been meaning to retrieve it for Mark II modifications.
Cheers
Phil.
Mulver Senior Member Joined: 27/02/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 160
Posted: 10:22am 04 Feb 2018
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Thanks for the advice George really appreciate it!!Edited by Mulver 2018-02-05
Notice. New forum software under development. It's going to miss a few functions and look a bit ugly for a while, but I'm working on it full time now as the old forum was too unstable. Couple days, all good. If you notice any issues, please contact me.
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