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Forum Index : Electronics : Thyristors for SPICE modelling
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CraziestOzzy Senior Member  Joined: 11/07/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 135 |
G'day, been on a web safari looking for a spice model for a two thyristor setup: 
...buggered if I know where to find one. Closest I came to get one was with International Rectifier company, using their IRK.136,142,162 series which have the near correct footprint I need, but they refer their power modules to another company who don't have SPICE models and that sux 
Even considered joining a NPN and PNP together but that really is the longest and hardest way to go, as the thyristor in question activates the gate with a drop in voltage as opposed to zero voltage. If you have a dual thyristor model in your library, could you share the text component (or even the entire model) of the SPICE code...pretty please  http://cr4.globalspec.com/member?u=25757 http://www.instructables.com/member/OzzyRoo/ |
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| davef Guru  Joined: 14/05/2006 Location: New ZealandPosts: 499 |
What SPICE program are you using? If there is such a thing I have a contact to try tomorrow. But first I'd like to know why you couldn't use two single device models? I am not aware of what is special about the device you are trying to model. Could you give me more info to help with the inquiry? Cheers, Dave |
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| CraziestOzzy Senior Member Joined: 11/07/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 135 |
...I have tried joining a NPN and PNP together and can't seem to get it and all the values right for use as a powermodule, especially when using the gates shown in the photo for a thyristor to thyristor module. And maybe I am barking up the wrong tree and will have to have another and different look at the approach I am using which clearly is not working for me. There are four outputs per module in pairs of two (4,5 and 6,7) for the gate and three (1,2 and 3) for the high voltage/current power....seen in the diagram above. Specification sheet is HERE I am somewhat challenged to turn off the gates at a low voltage as opposed to the "normal" zero voltages (typical for an SCR to SCR arrangement I believe at the top of my head) when custom making my part. Not having a configured model to get this thing simulating doesn't help either :) I am using "Circuit Design Suite/multisim V10" from NI but am happy to have any recent H or P-SPICE text file that contains the configuration for details contained in the Spec sheet I gave in the link. I can make the model but need SPICE values to run it. The closest I got to getting anything similar to what I need is when I used International Rectifier's (my module is from Eupec) IRK.136, 142, 162 series modules...but as luck would have it they referred the download of SPICE data files for these particular units to another website that doesn't provide SPICE files 
http://cr4.globalspec.com/member?u=25757 http://www.instructables.com/member/OzzyRoo/ |
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| davef Guru Joined: 14/05/2006 Location: New ZealandPosts: 499 |
So, you are joining a NPN thyristor and a PNP thyristor together? I can't tell from the image that the devices are different. Or are you joining a NPN transistor and PNP transistor to simulate one thyristor? A faint recollection is that you could model a thyristor by using a couple of transistors. Man, this is going back about 20 years here! In the package, are both thyristors the same? Preferably, you would like a model for this part which I could not obtain. How about a model of a thyristor that you could modify with relevant device parameters? We, as in the company I worked for recently, use models for LDMOS transistors. We do virtually no power supply work. However, one of the other technical gurus could point me in the right direction. HTH davef |
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| CraziestOzzy Senior Member Joined: 11/07/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 135 |
Yeah, tried that one today and both thyristors are the same. 
What I have found is a T90RIA-120 (from International Rectifier) which is close to the operation stats I need. This one I found uses two SCR's...but is somewhat a challenge to trigger to off state at around 2 volts instead of the usual zero volts...so I am having a crash course in SPICE code so I can write one up for myself using all the parameters relevant for the TT162N taken from the PDF Spec sheet I wish to use. Won't go too much into depth on this, was just kinda hoping someone may have a spare spice model for a single phase control thyristor. If you could throw my way "a model of a thyristor that you could modify with relevant device parameters" I won't knock it back... Otherwise I have to build one or fry some stuff in the real world to see what I can do with these babies. 
I scored 12 of them all up out of the four Allen Bradley Smart Motor Controllers I mention in previous post and really don't want to waste their potential in generator use by frying some eggs and bacon with them http://cr4.globalspec.com/member?u=25757 http://www.instructables.com/member/OzzyRoo/ |
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| davef Guru Joined: 14/05/2006 Location: New ZealandPosts: 499 |
Something has gone adrift here! I posted a reply to this after talking to an knowledgeable person and it doesn't seem to have made it to the site??? MicroCap9, which you can download a demo version has a model of a triac in it. Good luck |
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| CraziestOzzy Senior Member Joined: 11/07/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 135 |
yeah cheers....server down time over the weekend...lost my reply to you when you suggested "micrcap9" I managed to phone Infineon company down south and guy there who knew what I was talking about actually sounded keen to look into it for me and send me details in email. Failing that, will look into modding a triac...cheers http://cr4.globalspec.com/member?u=25757 http://www.instructables.com/member/OzzyRoo/ |
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Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Repost of missing posts, these go above davef's posting 22 march, 2 above. davef wrote..... The word is . . . download MicroCap9 demo version and in there you'll find a triac model. Under MACROS. Good luck CraziestOzzy wrote..... Contacted Infineon Technologies down south by phone and spoke to tech guru down there, so hopefully something may come of all this. I am halfway through the theory stage of designing my crazy setup to run my fish tank on green power ...then I can get the house chores done The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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