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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : # Flash slots - views needed
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| matherp Guru  Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9122 |
Recent changes to the firmware have increased the amount of RAM available and therefore the size of each flash slot. In addition the new functionality means that more of the flash has had to be allocated to the program space. Together these have reduced the size of the "A:" drive particularly on the PicoMite standard version. Question therefore is should I reduce the number of flash slots to 3 to recover disk space or leave things as they are - a: drive is 573440 bytes less any mod buffer enabled (used to play .mod files) |
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Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6798 |
Personally I'm happy with that. A: can often be backed up to B:. The flash slots are already at 3 if the library is used. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| EDNEDN Senior Member  Joined: 18/02/2023 Location: United StatesPosts: 118 |
Personally... In my mind the A: drive replaces the Flash Slot functionality in a very robust manner. Perhaps a few Flash Slots should be maintained for legacy reasons. But gradually shrinking those to Zero over time makes sense to me. |
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thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 4042 |
Given we have a flash drive "A:/", what is the use-case for flash slots ? For me: 1. A way to start a program on boot, though an "OPTION AUTORUN FILE" that always ran "A:/autoexec.bas" would IMO be better/simpler. 2. The LIBRARY ... well actually I don't give tuppence for the LIBRARY; my gut tells me any program that depends on it is fragile, but I accept that some people make use of it. 3. And thanks to the latest additions to the firmware using them as ROM for program assets; as used by the PETSCII Robots port. I'd be happy with "autoexec.bas" and just 2 slots, one as ROM and one as double-duty LIBRARY or ROM. YMMV, Tom Edited 2023-11-14 02:08 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9122 |
Flash slots can do something autoexec can't - chain programs with variables maintained. Library shouldn't be fragile anymore as I have fixed the tokens. I have got some space back anyway by using optimisation Os on more routines - things like the editor and MATH commands and other non-time-critical things like SETPIN. There is something strange in the way the RP2040 programs. If I reduce the program space to close to the flash usage as identified in the map (.text+.rodata) then MMBasic won't start so I have to leave at least 32Kb of extra space for the program over what I would expect. Current status with 4 flash slots is PICOMITE 655360 PICOMITEVGA 868352 WEBMITE 561152 decreasing the flash slots to 3 would increase these values by PICOMITE 135168 PICOMITEVGA 102400 WEBMITE 98304 |
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| gadgetjack Senior Member Joined: 15/07/2016 Location: United StatesPosts: 145 |
I am fine with losing the flash slots. A drive is great and useful. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6798 |
I can see I'm getting more and more outvoted here, but I do like being able to chain programs with intact variables. The size of A: is almost irrelevant if you have B: - and SD cards are a doddle to fit. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 4042 |
I'd love to have that ~130K back, 260K would be even better ;-) I've never used CHAIN, but fair enough. Observation 100-130K is a really big BASIC program; if you want one that big it can come from "A:/" ... and I don't believe you can fill it all anyway because of issues with the tokenizer. How difficult would it be to have 4 x 32-64K slots plus one 100K (or if you insist maximum size) for the library ? A good fix, but that wasn't actually the fragility I was talking about. I was thinking more along the lines of: - A single LIBRARY isn't a great fit when there are multiple programs by different developers who might try to use it. - Even considering a single developer, if they made a change to the API of something in the LIBRARY they would need to update all their programs simultaneously to adapt to that change. Best wishes, Tom Edited 2023-11-14 02:58 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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stanleyella Guru Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2129 |
I've got by never using flash slots or loading files. Beginners innocent bliss. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6798 |
Of course, if there was a "CHAIN <filename>" or maybe "RUN <filename>, CHAIN" command to retain the variables between program changes and an OPTION AUTOEXEC <filename> system the flash slots would probably be redundant. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| EDNEDN Senior Member Joined: 18/02/2023 Location: United StatesPosts: 118 |
That might be the best approach. If a person could chain from one file on the A: drive to another and keep the variables intact, that might satisfy everybody. If that was done, it might be logical to make keeping (or discarding) the variables an option on the chain command. Alternatively... Maybe chain could always keep the variables intact and run starts the next program fresh and clean? |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9122 |
You can't do that. The variable memory is used to load and tokenise the program before it is stored in flash |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6798 |
I can but dream...... :) . Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| Bleep Guru Joined: 09/01/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 509 |
I do use the flash slots, I currently have one application that uses 3 and chains them in sequence, I rarely use A: on a standard Pico, I do use A: on the Chinese versions with lots more flash available, one reason I don't regularly use A is that I have to connect an SD anyway if I do any updates as I've lost stuff before now by loosing the A: drive. Regards Kevin. |
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| Volhout Guru Joined: 05/03/2018 Location: NetherlandsPosts: 4243 |
Hi Peter, I am late to respond. Initially I would be in position to do away with all flash slots in favour of a larger A: drive. But that has changed now I see the benefit and speed advance of using a flash slot or library for graphical elements. This is really a important feature for game development. Petscii robots would not have been possible without it. So please leave minimal 2 flash slots alive (3 is also fine, as Kevin uses 3) and increase the size of the A drive to occupy the remaining flash. Leave the library function as it is now (occupying a flash slot), I do see benefit in it. Thank you for your consideration. Volhout Edited 2023-11-14 18:05 by Volhout PicomiteVGA PETSCII ROBOTS |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9122 |
Thanks for the feedback RC17 has changed to 3 flash slots. There will be no further changes to this |
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| thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 4042 |
 Thank you for your consideration Peter.Best wishes, Tom Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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