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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Controllers - here's an approach
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stanleyella Guru  Joined: 25/06/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2129 |
You mentioned it before so I looked it up and even ae near same price as rpi pico and no basic programming :( like saying use a arduino nano for io and analogue.,, (which I could do with gcb and help to interface to mmb as aside) This universal controller is giving me a haddock,it's not carp but whale kipper whelk um in the eel side What games need analogue joysticks? missile command? how do you do the slow pixel at a time plot for line xs,ys to xe,ye? l8r . |
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Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6792 |
Why design a system that's limited to start off with and is going to have to be replaced later? If the controller is programmable it is very easy to update. You might not want analogue just at the moment, but what about in a couple of months? I now have three PCB designs: Game*Mite buttons SNES-a-like but with buttons on both sides (I can't do a D-pad) Analogue + digital (you can use the joystick as a variable sensitivity D-pad) They all use the same RP2040-Zero and can all be programmed in MMBasic. All three can be I2C or TTL serial. I've been experimenting with HID over USB using Circuit Python, but that's not a necessity. The RP2040-Zero is a normal Pico but smaller. Same chip, same ram. Just less pins. They run MMBsic just like a Pico does. They are available under the Waveshare name or generic on AE. They are about £1.80 each. Here.. Don't just buy one, they work out expensive that way. Get 5 or so to qualify for free shipping. Edited 2023-12-20 06:37 by Mixtel90 Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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vegipete Guru Joined: 29/01/2013 Location: CanadaPosts: 1109 |
Here is the list of what the Wii controller built into the firmware can report: DEVICE(WII funct) Returns data from a Wii Classic controller. 'funct' is a 1 or 2 letter code indicating the information to return as follows: T returns the ID code of the controller - should be hex &H4200101 LX returns the position of the analog left joystick x axis LY returns the position of the analog left joystick y axis RX returns the position of the analog right joystick x axis RY returns the position of the analog right joystick y axis L returns the position of the analog left button R returns the position of the analog right button B returns a bitmap of the state of all the buttons. A bit will be set to 1 if the button is pressed. The button bitmap is as follows: BIT 0: Button R BIT 1: Button start BIT 2: Button home BIT 3: Button select BIT 4: Button L BIT 5: Button down cursor BIT 6: Button right cursor BIT 7: Button up cursor BIT 8: Button left cursor BIT 9: Button ZR BIT 10: Button x BIT 11: Button a BIT 12: Button y BIT 13: Button b BIT 14: Button ZL The nice part is that the data just magically appears. My programs don't have to do anything other than start the controller. For others building or interfacing a controller, look at this list of buttons and inputs and determine if your desired controller can be covered by what is on the list. As it stands, the list holds 6 analog readings and 15 digital signals. A sixteenth digital one could be added, I'm sure. Could the firmware be modified or augmented so that the signals from other controllers are put into suitable positions in this list. For many controllers, this means some of the positions will be blank. For others, the definitions might be slightly different. Maybe a CSub could be written, that is automagically called by the firmware at some rate and reads the hardware (somehow - serial, SPI, I2C, port pins, whatever) and populates the list with the results. The other question is how to get more than one controller, for two (or more) player games. I could imagine that opening a controller determines both the type and which position (out of 2, 4?) it occupies. Visit Vegipete's *Mite Library for cool programs. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6792 |
You can't have more than one WII controller on a port as they all have the same I2C address which is hard-wired. The PicoMite implementation depends on it being on System I2C, so you can only have one anyway. My proposed I2C system would normally allow 4 controllers on one port. That's a restriction that I propose because of cable capacitance. Four player games are unlikely on a PicoMite anyway. :) Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1611 |
This subject has been going on since the dawn of the Maximite. In over 20 years we have not even achieved a standard set of input pins for a joystick let alone anything more complex. Way back when Nick developed Maxman (AKA Pacman) for the mono Maximite he provided control using Keyboard, Nunchuk and Joystick but there were no standards. For what it's worth, I have played Tom's Lazer Cycle on the CMM2 (PS Labs Deluxe) with every controller that it supports and they all work flawlessly. I think it is the closest we are going to get to any standard. I'm not much of a gamer and any game that needs more than a joystick is probably too much for my tired old brain and arthritic fingers though. I can imagine using a 'black box' running Tom's controller library talking to MMB4W using something like Peter's original post describes but would worry about any lag that it might introduce. A method of determining which port was allocated by Windows for that device would go a long way to making it viable. You don't want to have people having to use Device Manager to identify which port to open. Of course if MMB4W could one of the available USB controllers that would be almost ideal. One last thing: Stan, Please stop banging on about the mcp23017. You are probably the only one to want to use bit 7 of either port as an input against the manufactures recommendation. I may work for you but YOU cannot guarantee it! Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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thwill Guru Joined: 16/09/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 4040 |
<banging-on> It's not the firmware, but that's exactly what my controller library does, returns the same bit-pattern (for NES, SNES, Atari Joystick and Game*Mite) as the Wii Classic controllers do on CMM2 and PicoMite. </banging-on> Best wishes, Tom Edited 2023-12-20 09:51 by thwill Game*Mite, CMM2 Welcome Tape, Creaky old text adventures |
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| al18 Senior Member  Joined: 06/07/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 205 |
I think the Wii Classic Controller is an excellent choice. While I enjoy building PicoMites, when I’m gaming I want an ergonomically designed controller that works well and will continue to work for years without fixing it. If it does break, I can easily buy a replacement. |
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TassyJim Guru Joined: 07/08/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 6098 |
This snippit is all you need to scan for ports that are present. ' FOR n = 1 TO 32 ON ERROR SKIP OPEN "com"+STR$(n)+":115200" AS #2 IF MM.ERRNO THEN ' print mm.errmsg$ ELSE PRINT "com"+STR$(n)+" present" 'pause(100) test$ = INPUT$(20,#2) PRINT test$ CLOSE #2 ENDIF NEXT n END If your Wii emulator is running and spitting out data, there should be something recognisable in the buffer. You can use that to work out which port is the one you want. I put this on a pico ' DO PRINT "Hello Wii people" PAUSE(10) LOOP and the results from the scan running in MMBasic for DOS was: Windows MMBasic Ver 5.05.05 Copyright 2011-2021 Geoff Graham com4 present com5 present com6 present ople Hello Wii peop com7 present > com6 is the one we want. Unfortunately, there seems to be a bug in MMB4W  I tried a number of different betas with the same result. Bugger... Jim VK7JH MMedit MMBasic Help |
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| Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1611 |
Thanks Jim, I tried that in MMBasic for DOS and MMB4W and the scanning code works well. I had no com ports used but plugged in my MM2 test/programming board and it was then found. One way I thought of identifying the games port would be to first scan the ports and build an array of ports identified (just noughts and ones), have the user plug the device in, then rescan. The new device will be on the newly found com port. The MMBasic for DOS response looks funny: com6 present ople Hello Wii peop com7 present Was that some type of typo? or was that actually what you saw? AHA! no you just got the end of one message and the beginning of the next.  An arcade type games controller would be easy to realize with an MM2, a serial to USB and a few buttons and resistors. A Wii interface could be even simpler if we could use the USB to simulate a keyboard. But first the bug needs squashing.  Bill PS plugging in a second keyboard also works well - I'm typing on it now Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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| matherp Guru Joined: 11/12/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 9118 |
On MMB4W you can you the function comport(n) to test if a port exists without using the abomination that is "on error" |
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LeoNicolas Guru Joined: 07/10/2020 Location: CanadaPosts: 479 |
I'm just watching this discussion because I'm not a hardware engineer, and for sure, my suggestion, if I had one, will sound dumb  The results you decide will be great for the MMBasic community and the games we are developing for the platforms. I couldn't implement support for gamepads yet in Knightmare because MMB4W doesn't support them. For me, the development workflow from the MMB4W is much better than developing directly on the target machine. After completing the game I will tweak the source code (or anyone who wants to) to run on other machines. |
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| Bleep Guru Joined: 09/01/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 509 |
I bought a Wii classic, because it's cheap & there was hardware support now built in, interfacing it to Petscii Robots was very simple, it supports 2 analogue joysticks, 1 up/down/left/right switch & 11 various other buttons, I realise my interpretation of what knobs/buttons to use for Petscii may not be optimal, but they are trivial to change to whatever you may want. So my vote is to stick with Wii Classic or Pro, I think electricly they are the same, they just added handles & moved some of the buttons a bit. From a game point of view I can't envisage needing more. Regards Kevin. |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6792 |
The Pro has some bits moved around, the wire out of the back and the "shoulder" buttons changed from analogue+ s witch to switch only. You used to be able to get similar handles to fit the normal Classic onto. If I had the right screwdriver I'd try opening mine up, taking the latch mechanism out and re-routing the wire through the hole where the latch button is. Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| Bleep Guru Joined: 09/01/2022 Location: United KingdomPosts: 509 |
Yes I will probably do that, the wire out the bottom seems wrong. Regards Kevin |
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| Mixtel90 Guru Joined: 05/10/2019 Location: United KingdomPosts: 6792 |
You have to remember how they are intended to be used - plugged into a wiicontroller, which gives a bluetooth link to the box. The lead is towards user because the wiicontroller is on their belt or round their neck. A short lead is fine, as is a fixed I2C address. The screwdriver is a little 3-wing design that needs to be long enough to get down the holes. I have a security bit that would probably do it but it's too short. :( Mick Zilog Inside! nascom.info for Nascom & Gemini Preliminary MMBasic docs & my PCB designs |
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| Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1611 |
Thank you Peter, this works: ' FOR n = 1 TO 32 if Comport(n) then PRINT "com"+STR$(n)+" present" ENDIF NEXT n END  I have not updated to the latest MMB4W yet. Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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| Turbo46 Guru Joined: 24/12/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1611 |
For interest sake: If I have Teraterm connected to a 'mite and run the program: FOR n = 1 TO 32 ON ERROR SKIP OPEN "com"+STR$(n)+":38400" AS #2 IF MM.ERRNO THEN ELSE PRINT "com"+STR$(n)+" present" test$ = INPUT$(20,#2) PRINT test$ CLOSE #2 ENDIF NEXT n END Does not detect the port but it does if I close down Teraterm though. The program: FOR n = 1 TO 32 if Comport(n) then PRINT "com"+STR$(n)+" present" ENDIF NEXT n END method does detect the port whether the port is active or not. So the ON ERROR method may still be useful for detecting a device plugged in but not yet in use. Bill Keep safe. Live long and prosper. |
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